Christians didn't wait for Henry VIII to start spl...
Alex · 2008-12-03T03:45:00
Christians didn't wait for Henry VIII to start splitting pretty permanently -- the division between "Catholic" (Roman) and "Orthodox" (Greek) churches far predates that (and the funny thing is that both would claim to be "universal" AND "the right doctrine", which is what the two words _mean_;-).
Even within "protestantism", Luther's 95 Theses date from 1517, his excommunication from 1521; Henry's key Acts were in 1532 (I'd consider the "Submission of the Clergy" Act as the turning point) and his excommunication was in 1533 -- so Luther has temporal precedence (not to mention SOME strong theology, but I guess you wouldn't want to discuss that;-).
@Alex: I should have known I could trust you to be...
Steve · 2008-12-03T04:08:00
@Alex: I should have known I could trust you to be erudite on these matters. Or any others, come to that.
I was aware of Lutheran theology's difference with the Catholic church, but had forgotten (my history was learned long ago) that it predated Henry's excommunication. As for the Greeks, they weren't even included in the somewhat limited European history I got from an English grammar school. The Eastern and Western schisms were briefly mentioned, but not discussed in detail.
My excuse is that our history teacher found it a better use of his time to leave us reading in class and visit the pub. If he couldn't be persuaded to take his subject seriously I had trouble discerning why it was important to me.
In this passage I now learn that "Occasions of friction, hostility, and open division on doctrinal questions as well as matters of discipline and daily practice had occurred long before 1054 - for example, the Photian schism of the 9th century." What better reason to start torturing and persecuting each other?
@Alex [again]: I wouldn't mind discussing Lutheran...
Steve · 2008-12-03T04:11:00
@Alex [again]: I wouldn't mind discussing Lutheran theology, but could only do so from a position of profound ignorance. I don't even know how many angels could dance on the head of a pin.
I think the previous Anonymous might be being a li...
Anonymous · 2008-12-03T10:48:00
I think the previous Anonymous might be being a little sarcastic with the Jesus comment... :)
However, the question 'can Jesus help me?' is an important one.
After many years as an Evangelical Christian, and now no longer being one, my considered opinion is, 'He can if you think he can'.
that was fun to read!I guess you already know than...
Anonymous · 2008-12-03T10:59:00
that was fun to read!
I guess you already know than when one debates with official religion, the person always loses (if the debate is take out of the humorous context). It was a nice read anyway!
"I don't even know how many angels could dance on ...
Paddy3118 · 2008-12-03T11:51:00
"I don't even know how many angels could dance on the head of a pin."
42!
(Or am I mixing religions)
The interesting thing is that almost any open door...
Anonymous · 2008-12-03T16:38:00
The interesting thing is that almost any open door, international christian organization could call themselves catholic apostolic, since that means universal (or worldwide) and teaching derived from the apostles. Now roman, (i.e. with its headquarters in the city of Rome) is only one church AFAIK. So maybe it should be just called the Roman Church. But then people with links to "Roman Music" would probably get wrong invitations ...
Christians didn't wait for Henry VIII to start spl...
Alex · 2008-12-03T03:45:00
Christians didn't wait for Henry VIII to start splitting pretty permanently -- the division between "Catholic" (Roman) and "Orthodox" (Greek) churches far predates that (and the funny thing is that both would claim to be "universal" AND "the right doctrine", which is what the two words _mean_;-).Even within "protestantism", Luther's 95 Theses date from 1517, his excommunication from 1521; Henry's key Acts were in 1532 (I'd consider the "Submission of the Clergy" Act as the turning point) and his excommunication was in 1533 -- so Luther has temporal precedence (not to mention SOME strong theology, but I guess you wouldn't want to discuss that;-).
@Alex: I should have known I could trust you to be...
Steve · 2008-12-03T04:08:00
@Alex: I should have known I could trust you to be erudite on these matters. Or any others, come to that.I was aware of Lutheran theology's difference with the Catholic church, but had forgotten (my history was learned long ago) that it predated Henry's excommunication. As for the Greeks, they weren't even included in the somewhat limited European history I got from an English grammar school. The Eastern and Western schisms were briefly mentioned, but not discussed in detail.
My excuse is that our history teacher found it a better use of his time to leave us reading in class and visit the pub. If he couldn't be persuaded to take his subject seriously I had trouble discerning why it was important to me.
In this passage I now learn that "Occasions of friction, hostility, and open division on doctrinal questions as well as matters of discipline and daily practice had occurred long before 1054 - for example, the Photian schism of the 9th century." What better reason to start torturing and persecuting each other?
@Alex [again]: I wouldn't mind discussing Lutheran...
Steve · 2008-12-03T04:11:00
@Alex [again]: I wouldn't mind discussing Lutheran theology, but could only do so from a position of profound ignorance. I don't even know how many angels could dance on the head of a pin.I think the previous Anonymous might be being a li...
Anonymous · 2008-12-03T10:48:00
I think the previous Anonymous might be being a little sarcastic with the Jesus comment... :)However, the question 'can Jesus help me?' is an important one.
After many years as an Evangelical Christian, and now no longer being one, my considered opinion is, 'He can if you think he can'.
that was fun to read!I guess you already know than...
Anonymous · 2008-12-03T10:59:00
that was fun to read!I guess you already know than when one debates with official religion, the person always loses (if the debate is take out of the humorous context). It was a nice read anyway!
"I don't even know how many angels could dance on ...
Paddy3118 · 2008-12-03T11:51:00
"I don't even know how many angels could dance on the head of a pin."42!
(Or am I mixing religions)
The interesting thing is that almost any open door...
Anonymous · 2008-12-03T16:38:00
The interesting thing is that almost any open door, international christian organization could call themselves catholic apostolic, since that means universal (or worldwide) and teaching derived from the apostles. Now roman, (i.e. with its headquarters in the city of Rome) is only one church AFAIK. So maybe it should be just called the Roman Church. But then people with links to "Roman Music" would probably get wrong invitations ...Older comments · Page 2 of 2
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